My Uni offers a scholarship to pay for a summer abroad and I'm a pretty good candidate to getting it. Probably is, the scholarship is limited to women only. I'm not sure if I am "ethically" eligible. To get it, I would also have to out myself to certain people at Uni.
Should I apply?
Do you know every thought that crosses your mind? To know the mind of many is to know the depth of the ocean. Where at? What era? Why? It is to ask of heaven, how many stars? Those near, those far, those seen, unseen, heard by whom, in darkness, alone, or in sunlight, beyond? How far? Who cares? Our creator, over all seasons presiding, knows each mind by name.Originally Posted by 4serrus
You know, sometimes that sort of program has been put in place to level what was seen as a male-dominated playing field. If this was the case here, I can see you still being able to apply in the spirit of the award as part of the LGBT community without any ethical issues whatsoever. Yes, you would have to out yourself - but you were still born and raised female and that part of your history might as well get you ahead somewhere.
On the other hand, would it be awkward for you (and the university) to explain why when a girl was expected on the other end of this summer abroad, they got you? If one of the conditions of this women only scholarship is that you share dorms and bathrooms with other women? Would you be okay with that and everything that went along with it?
I agree with BaBeba. Could you be ok with being seen as a girl for this? Also another question can you get the same thing you are doing with the scholarship some were else? If the answer is no and you really need it then do what you must.
I'd say that you'd be ethically eligible for this if you have an "F" on your ID and are legally a woman. Otherwise, you're courting the possibility of a vicious backlash from the other women in the program if you are discovered. An exclusively female program isn't likely to draw participants who are sympathetic to the trangendered! From their point of view you will be stealing a spot from another woman and they won't like it at all.
Eryn
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If you are a man then don't apply... it's not for you, and you shouldn't be saying you're female regardless of what your ID says. If you're not a man then it's up to you, and there's obviously no ethical problem in that case anyway.
Even when my ID said female I would not have considered it for a second. I seriously question whether someone is male if they are willing to claim they're a woman simply to manipulate something.
Logan, you are 100% right. I don't feel I am eligible for the award.
I am considering it, however. A older transwoman of my acquaintance who transitioned years and years ago, said that she was glad for having played rugby and football because she enjoyed them and it made her feel better about not being able to participate in the women's social activities. I desperately wanted to wrestle for the school, but neither my middle school coach nor my high school coach (and certainly not the college coach) would let me join their teams. And her advice is, if I'm going to get screwed because I was born female, I should enjoy the few perks that come here and there. . . so I can look back on college and have some exceptionally good memories, like she has.
What do you think?
Do you know every thought that crosses your mind? To know the mind of many is to know the depth of the ocean. Where at? What era? Why? It is to ask of heaven, how many stars? Those near, those far, those seen, unseen, heard by whom, in darkness, alone, or in sunlight, beyond? How far? Who cares? Our creator, over all seasons presiding, knows each mind by name.
Hi, Seamus.
Tho this may or not apply , as im intersexed i could apply , one of the things for me has been being accepted for who i am , is that the same for you . . so wether you are a woman or a male is there an issue or is it a perceved one. only you can answer that knowing what you are inside
if this was given to me i would take it. thats me tho... part of being different .
...noeleena...
I think that is bullshit.What do you think?
For me, every memory became something I am significantly more proud of, no matter how small, once I became recognized as male. Whereas every memory I have from while I was still seen as female is basically blocked from my mind because it is tainted, no matter how much reason I have to be proud. If you want exceptional memories there are gender-inclusive ways to make them, where you can be seen as a man.
I really wanted to join a school football team for a while, but when I realized it was an unreasonable desire I didn't run out and join women's volleyball or something. I moved on, accepted that while those experiences would be cool the majority of people do not have them, and that there are other ways to make 'exceptional memories' without compromising your identity (which would be the case with women's sports). For me two ways of doing that have been volunteering to help an international organization I believe in (won't state which one here), and attending my best friend's wedding as best man despite being afraid of multiple aspects involved. Both of those memories are 'exceptional' to me, and neither required me to be seen as anything other than a man.
I will actually be highly offended if you do apply for this because you will run the risk of reinforcing the belief that transmen are not really male, should not be treated as male, and should be given the benefits afforded to women rather than men.
Last edited by brylram; 09-05-2011 at 08:10 AM.
Unless you put out all the information on what this program actually is, no one could give you a 'real' answer.
But if you pass and/or are out as a man then across the board I would probably say don't do it.
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This piece of info:Unless you put out all the information on what this program actually is, no one could give you a 'real' answer.
and this one (in response to me saying "if you're a man then don't apply"):the scholarship is limited to women only
are all the information needed. Knowing 'where to' or 'how much money' or anything like that wouldn't tell us anything relevant to the decision of 'does this apply to men/me'.you are 100% right. I don't feel I am eligible for the award.
In my opinion it would.
Because, really, what are the chances he'd be allowed to go after a men's-only scholarship (assuming it existed)?
I don't know about Canada-- usually they're a lot better about this type of thing-- but in the US that shit would never fly. If the university isn't going to let me do what I want because I happened to not be born with the right genitals, then I really would take into consideration a women's-only scholarship/program. If I thought I could handle living as a woman or whatever it needed.
"Don't hold out on me, J! I thought we could have a conversation about boobies!"
US Navy. Forward deployed. Hardly here. Homeport: Sasebo, Nagasaki, Japan.
I strongly believe that if you define yourself as discluding female from your identity, regardless of what you identify as otherwise, then any significant opportunity designated as 'female only' should not be considered as something to apply to. However, only you can decide how you identify, or how loosely you describe/think of yourself, and what male means to you.
Scholarships are elective. If one is not available to me I walk away. I feel it would compromise my own identity, risk compromising the respect given to transmen as a whole, or possibly risk reaffirming the idea that being transgender is imagined or only used to gain some benefit that would otherwise not be afforded. I especially do not even CONSIDER doing any of those things for something like studying abroad. I don't believe it is necessary to a happy/successful life, and believe that the only time it is EVER acceptable to involve a legal designation that contradicts someone's actual identity is when dealing with government processes that cannot be avoided, or with healthcare. Life is harder without scholarships, but I personally believe that is ok, and that there are many roads in life which can lead to success and happiness without scholarships or studying abroad.
IMPORTANT EDIT:
I've edited this entire post because discussion with a friend brought it to my attention that I come across so strongly they believe I could make someone suicidal. I personally believe in stating opinions strongly, and that is how I like to see them, but not everyone feels the same. I believe that we don't grow from holding back opinions, but instead benefit most from stating them fully (flaws included) and being strongly replied to with contradicting opinions. However, not everyone is comfortable with that so I will try to be more moderate in my approach.
I have strong opinions, but opinion is all they are. Anyone who wants to apply for a scholarship can do so, and they will succeed or not based on the guidelines of the scholarship. Anyone who defines themself in a way I disagree with is not wrong simply because I disagree. We all need to transition based on our own identities, desires, and beliefs. I will not keep my opinions to myself on the basis that they might upset someone. Views similar to mine are rarely represented because someone might be upset, which only serves to isolate a part of the population. I apologize for any feelings I hurt, or doubts I cause, but there are probably also people who are glad to see what I have to say. Maybe, maybe not, but I am still here giving my OPINION.
Keep in mind that people are free to disagree with me, and if there are members who disagree with my opinions or have alternative ones to offer then please do so. I've been the strongest contributor to this thread, but I have only one view on things. A more diverse set of opinions is always welcome, and will be of greater assistance to the individual who has asked a question.
Last edited by brylram; 09-09-2011 at 06:20 PM.
Always try to advance your position.
I agree with Eryn, the potential for backlash could be huge. I also think that if you present as the male gender full time, switching out just for the trip would probably be something that you would not enjoy in the long run, and may even make the trip a lot less appealing for you. Sometimes if we wish to change our birth gender, we can't just go back whenever we want. The trip and changing for a short time could affect you more than you realize.
It comes down to one statement really, "nobody likes a fair weather fan". Not trying to be mean, but if you do this, there's a huge potential for ramifications from both the GGs you'll be traveling with, and the transmale community.
As far as the argument about a men's only scholarship, Caucasian males do not get anything like that, ever. There's absolutely no advantage that you could have as a Caucasian male. In fact, the exclusion of you from sports probably had more to do with your size, than your birth gender. I knew a young woman that wrestled, played football, and generally did all guy activities in high school. She was big and strong enough to avoid injury, which is probably the only reason you were turned away. Scrawny GMs are also turned away, or told if you don't bulk up you can't play. That's how it was at my high school, anyways. Can't vouch for college.
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If it was a sponsorship for a male, you wouldn't have been able to apply too, because you are not legally male. And now you cant apply for this because you are legally female but psychologically male. WTF, You will be screwed either way if you think too much and let others do thinking for you. Plain and simple, that scholarship is meant for girls with F on the id, take advantage of it.
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